In which crazy comes out… (Get off my side)

Initially I was writing up a post and just ran out of time on it but that is melding into this one. You see there was a group of people who engaged in attention seeking behavior during the January 15th rally and legislative meet that has quite honestly created a serious rift. Not only has it created a rift but there is a bit more of a history involved than just, “the crazies showed up.” It should be noted that the following is my observations only and is not in any way to be attributed to any group I may volunteer for or work with.

Brief Background:

Before the tally was even fully complete an individual started organizing a rally December 13th. There were numerous other individuals who were attempting to help ensure:

  1. The event went off without any serious problems and remained a positive event.
  2. That people would stay engaged and continue to be supportive come the opening of the legislature.

The group support route was heavily rejected. So much so that it actually made the Seattle Times as the organizer made decisions that were not exactly positive. Free permit, oh my god it’s the end of the world because they’re wanting a logistical heads up. But I digress. The permit thing became a very serious craw and caused many to just walk away to leave that organizer on his own. We didn’t detract from his protest but we weren’t supplying effort to support him, he was on his own.

At the same time, actually starting in September, conversation was started regarding an event at the capital in the event 594 passed. We directed the effort of all the groups trying to help with the December 13th rally to one where input, help, and unification actually came in to play. This however didn’t stop claims from the other group of how we were undermining or attacking them. How no one really knows.

As we closed in on January 15th, it became more and more common. Attacking people who were working to support what they felt were going to be effective methods instead of what many felt of the December 13th rally where it would be a giant circle jerk where nothing was really accomplished.

Well nothing happened at the December 13th rally, there was no actual outcome or changes because of the rally. Not saying that people shouldn’t have gone, but I have limited amounts of time and I have absolutely no interest in wasting my time on symbolic gestures. My goal is to be effective and actually achieve what I set out to do. I am also strategic about it and am willing to play the chess game to make it happen.

Some of people also tried to claim the rally was the work of SAF, CCRKBA, POGR, etc. Nope, sorry, hate to break it to you, it was 100% grass-roots. Know how I know? Because I was sitting at the tables helping plan the damn thing.

What Happened:

The morning of the 15th the rally was set up and all was well and good. At the start of the rally everyone was gathered on the steps and the speakers began. There were a couple outbursts yelling at speakers from a group of about 15-20 in the back who eventually moved all the way to the top of the Capitol steps. They had banners from the December 13 rally and were waving them. They yelled a couple of times to garner attention with one-off statements. Everyone for the most part ignored them. They started becoming more disruptive during Paige Biron’s speech. I just ignored it, that is until we heard the familiar sound of charging handles and bolts. I was mortified when I looked back to see loaded magazines being pulled and inserted and charging handles struck. This happened about midway through Joe Huffman’s speech. Who they kept trying to talk over as well. Joe did a fantastic job refusing to engage the misbehaving and distracting children in the back.

After the children started playing with their firearms there was a rapid influx of Washington State Patrol officers. One officer immediately approached the MC to find out how we would like to deal with the situation. I at the time was searching for another organizer so we could effectively talk to State Patrol. Everyone around me in the crowd, many of who were long time gunnies were noticeably alarmed and uncomfortable with what was going on. At least 3 people made comments about why WSP was not arresting them under R.C.W. 9.41.270.

Source, The News Tribune

I need to buy that WSP officer a coffee.

After chatting with the M.C. the WSP officer immediately went up the stairs and shortly after the group dispersed into the Capitol. One lone individual came out yelling, “Patriots come help us storm our capitol.” After 3 times he gave up and moved on. It should also be noted they did this just before Matt Shea spoke about HB-1245 and other pro-gun bills were discussed. I suppose not being at the center of attention was too much for them.

From there they entered the Capitol, I wasn’t present for it but the news media was.


 Here’s a copy of the video of what happened in the gallery.

As much time as I spent in the legislative office buildings I didn’t see any of these individuals there. I only ever saw them in the capitol building so I don’t think they were there to actually engage and talk with their legislators.

Stop coon fingering your weapon, leave it alone unless you actually need it, you narcissistic attention whore.

From there we move into more WTFery.


This does not help engender relations or confidence with those on the other side, much less the fence. I found out that calls were coming into Olympia dispatch about an active shooter at the Capitol. It appears there were some Legislative Aids who were unaware of the rally, and the presence of masked men and long arms raised their concern.

Boy wonder himself makes an appearance in this thread, though I’m not sure it’s publicly accessible. Watching him get roasted by our side was quite entertaining.


Press coverage did exactly what you expected. Focus on the crazy, ignore the every day individual.

Anette Wachter is interviewed by Q13 fox.

Anette Wachter is interviewed by Q13 fox.

Thankfully Q-13 did air part of their interview with Adina, however most of the actual photo coverage is the individuals above. As usual our buddies at the CSGV used the stupidity to their advantage.


The worst part though is there is now a threat to open carry in the Capitol. The initial shot came this morning:

Lt. Gov. Brad Owen announced Friday that the public will no longer be able to openly carry firearms in the state Senate chamber’s public viewing area.

Owen said a notice of the change will be posted outside the gallery at the Capitol, likely before Monday’s floor session.

“We’re just noting that open carry is a form of demonstration and it’s no different than carrying a placard or something else of that nature,” he said.

I suspect this is going to backfire as anyone who can legally own a firearm but does not have a CPL must open carry. I don’t concealed carry or open carry, I just freaking carry. The problem is we have people like the above who carry at people and that is the problem. I suspect a bar on long guns could probably stand, doubly so as this particular group was trying to use the long guns in a form of protest which is expressly forbidden in the gallery.

Dave Workman had this to say:

UPDATE (Friday, 5:45 p.m.) The Associated Press is now reporting that the State Senate is banning the open carry of firearms in the Senate gallery. This announcement underscores the backlash being expressed by many rights activists, including people who were at Thursday’s rally, who were not favorably impressed by the open carry demonstration. There were several people in the crowd who were openly carrying sidearms, and who have been critical of the long gun exhibition.

Honestly I wish that WSP had nailed them under 270 or the violation of the gallery rules regarding protest and use of props. If you want to carry, then carry. But don’t carry and then try to break the rules thinking your special. All you do is look like an ass and make the rest of us look bad, and in the end sabotage the efforts of the people you claim to support. Not only that but you may run rights backwards by being retarded.

Additional side notes:

The organizer for the December 13th rally was arrested on the 15th. It appears yelling at a judge while approaching the bench is not acceptable courtroom behavior.

In addition, he allegedly took exception to a ruling by Judge Judith L. McCauley because she did not want spectators live-streaming video from the courtroom.

“Seim began yelling at the judge and walking toward her bench,” Gjesdal said. McCauley “ordered him removed from the courtroom.”

When deputies tried to escort him out, he allegedly began to pull away and resist. He was placed under arrest and later booked into jail for interfering with a court, disorderly conduct and contempt of court, Gjesdal said.

Most entertainingly the stupidity appeared to be genetic as his father decided to get arrested in a show of solidarity with him.

How I feel…

Honestly I feel a bit betrayed by my own. Get the hell off my side. As someone reminded me tonight:

“Politics is the art of the possible.”

We are quite literally trying to accomplish the impossible in a not totally friendly environment. We need 2/3s majority to touch anything and that isn’t possible without fence sitters. Further when people on our own side are shaking their heads you can turn what was a level battle into an uphill one. We most likely won’t actually get a full repeal this round, after yesterday it most likely will be DOA as it won’t even make it through committee since that’s not full of friendlies. My goal is to be effective and get shit done. Acting like a child and throwing a tantrum doesn’t help anyone. All it does is make you look like an ass. Tell me, is anyone other than the child excited when throwing a tantrum in a store?

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About TMM

TMM is the owner, editor, and principal author at The Minuteman, a competitive shooter, and staff member for Boomershoot. Even in his free time he’s merging his love and knowledge of computers and technology with his love of firearms. Many know his private name and information however due to the current political climate, many are distancing themselves due to the abandonment of Due Process.

33 Responses to In which crazy comes out… (Get off my side)

  1. Wolfman says:

    I cannot, literally CANNOT find a way to justify active gun handling and the wearing of a gas mask in the Capitol building to make a political point. Hypothetically speaking, the only way that would constitute anything less than ridiculous behavior is during an active, live-fire engagement. I understand that people can be ‘No Compromise’, even though I find its political effectiveness somewhat lacking. That takes conviction, and conviction is something that it is possible to have even if you lack everything else. What i can’t justify is engaging in behavior that can ONLY end in harm for your political goals, and perhaps, harm for you, physically, without need. The guy with the gas mask is an asshole, and he’s hurting the rest of us. It pisses me off.

    • Barron says:

      You have no idea. Even the pro-gun legislators are calling up the firearms lobbyists going, “We have a problem right now.”

      They seriously kicked the hornets nest.

      • Wolfman says:

        Of course, the first thing I see on Facebook this morning was from a firearms group here in OR, gushing about how these true patriots stole a rally from the ‘cowardly compromisers’ and then ‘took the Capitol!’ Goddammit. Dropped. Any suggestions on a VIABLE gun rights group in Oregon?

  2. Pingback: “Stop Helping” Files: Notes from a witness to Washington’s Open Carry Idiots. | Gun Free Zone

  3. Miguel says:

    I might be feeling a bit pessimistic, but these idiots pretty much killed any pro-2A initiative for your state this year.

    • Barron says:

      Not being pessimistic. I’m hearing nonpositive things from legislators on our side now. Including the Governor possibly working on a ban of firearms on the capitol campus.

      Top that off, the good side has a black eye because we’re being lumped in with the idiots.

  4. Mark Whitaker says:

    Every time I try to talk about firearms issues with the liberals these days, I’m getting these damn aggressive open carry protests thrown in my face. Tired of spending so much energy trying to get out from under that, and having them assume that anything the open carry protesters want must, by definition, be unreasonable, and if I want the same things, I must be a whacko, too. I think these people did more damage to our hopes of undoing the worst of 594 in one day, than the anti-2A forces could have done in months. Still going to write and talk to my local reps, anyway, and hope that we can eventually make some headway in spite of these “allies.”

    • Barron says:

      Please contact your reps. Let them know there were two groups there and the minority caused the problems.

      It’s actually been funny as of late because people seem to think I’m against open carry because I’m not completely off the deep end and I’m working towards what’s feasible. As Tam put it, and rightfully so, I want machine guns to be available out of vending machines. I’m just not a retard about trying to accomplish that.

      Seriously I can’t help but think I missed out on something totally awesome with being able to have firearms mailed to your house.

  5. Those people are just devastatingly stupid.

  6. Pingback: Facepalm

  7. Kristophr says:

    You have to plan for idiocy, as well as agent provacateurs and cranks.

    TEA Party protests usually have a supply of signs saying “This person is not one of us” or “agent provocateur”, and volunteers to carry one next to the looneys, leftists, and nazis that show up.

  8. John says:

    That’s strange. My comment disappeared. Would someone from SAF care to comment on this? (link redacted, I am not an advertising platform for those people. For context this is the same group as above.)

    • Barron says:

      I do not work for SAF, have no authority to speak for SAF, and I don’t know where these people got the idea that CCRKBA/SAF organized this rally. Allan was merely invited to speak, that is IT.

      As for the details in the article I presume you are talking about, I cannot actually find information confirming some of the claims. Other parts are known but are presented in the form of half truths and misrepresentation of facts. I suggest actually finding multiple independent sources, preferably of public record to get the full context.

      Note the method and behavior of their post is similar to that of the CSGV in their treatment of gun-bloggers. No to mention the fact before you can even comment you need to join their house.

      *Only reason you didn’t go through earlier was the spam filter tagged you.*

  9. Gee….another Mulford Act in the wake of open carry at a State Capitol, who didn’t see this coming…….

  10. Jeff says:

    You know, I open carried a rifle at the big protest in Jan 2013. But I dressed respectably, the rifle had a chamber flag installed, clearly indicating that it was not loaded, and it never once left my back.

    In 2013, that was when federal and state AWBs were being discussed and aggressively pushed by politicians in the wake of Sandy Hook. Those carrying that style of rifle in a peaceful assembly were making a point, that normal everyday citizens owned and used these rifles responsibly.

    Now it’s just a contest over who can look the most badass, showing up to the capitol in their pajama pants and Carhartts, carrying a full combat load of mags as if they’re actually going into battle. They make no effort whatsoever to appear to be sane and rational, which is what we’re trying to convince the anti-gun public.

    Gas mask guy is the worst out of all of them. A lot of good it would even do him, since it doesn’t have a canister installed.

    Yeah, I’m pissed off that we have to appease the politicians and public to begin with, but frankly I’m even more sick of the in-your-face crowd ruining our efforts to appear to be anything other than the camo-clad yokels that they already believe us to be.

    • Barron says:

      You sir nailed it. I’ve carried rifles when appropriate, my rule, don’t touch them. As Tam likes to say there is carrying and then carrying at people. These people like to do the latter thinking it’s the former.

      It’s annoying to say the least when people end up making you have to spend time defending what we already had.

  11. Old NFO says:

    Y’all got F’ed… I can’t help but wonder IF that was a false flag done on purpose to try to torpedo y’all.

    • Barron says:

      There have been a decent number of people bringing up the false flag idea. Sadly no. They are just that freaking stupid.

    • Kelly Kafir says:

      No, the Gavin Seim people are really simple that stupid… they don’t understand that what they did hurt us. They are all hyped up on the TV series, “Sons of Liberty” so they think that anyone who doesn’t believe as they do and agree to have countless rally after rally is a coward and a “bootkicker”

  12. Windy Wilson says:

    There’s a reason the other side buses in their protesters.
    Vet their costumes before they get on the bus.

  13. Nice read. I was at the rally too and felt this other group was a distraction. BTW, I’m a retired EE who did the stuff you are doing (back in the day). It didn’t start being called ’embedded systems’ just microprocessor application design and there was little distinction between HW and SW design, you did it all (4004, 8008, 8080, etc). A big help was getting eproms and prom programmers. I hated having to write down the binary code for the instructions and then submitting it to a vendor to get blasted proms — very slow turn around.

  14. PeaceableGuy says:

    Having seen the rotten insides of the Republican party up close and personal, as well as the way rooms full of so-called liberty lovers turn hostile to congressional candidates who promise to obey and uphold the Constitution – specifically to include dismantling all the illegal fedgov programs such as Education, IRS, DEA, etc. – one conclusion remains.

    You can’t vote your way out of this tyranny.

    While no one appreciates morons with busy fingers near their firearms, it is foolish and sefl-defeating to conflate those types with people who have realized that the god of “the LAW” is a false god and now treat unConstitutional laws as the null and void non-laws that they are (recognized by Marbury vs Madison and Norton vs Shelby County):

    “An unconstitutional act is not law; it confers no rights; it imposes no duties; affords no protection; it creates no office; it is in legal contemplation, as inoperative as though it had never been passed.”

    One possible way for those of you who still think you can vote tyranny away to be constructive towards common goals shared with people like Gavin Seim is to remind your politicians that they should quickly work with you… else they’ll have to deal with “people like them!”

    • Barron says:

      The problem is, dealing with people like them is fairly easy and their behavior makes convincing law makers to work with me to repeal the unjust laws considerably more difficult.

      If you ever actually pay attention, it isn’t the guy who yells and screams, rattles his saber, and talks a big game that you need to worry about. More often than not a single well placed hit will cause them to leave immediately to seek other opportunities for their attention seeking behavior.

      It is the reserved contemplative man who sits in the back, speaks softly with purpose, and has a largely diverse set of skills who has no interest in fame or fortune but merely to secure his rights and property. That is the man our law makers should, and rightfully so, fear. Many of them in fact do. The problem is crazy like this comes out, throws a wrench in the works and now the reserved contemplative man is left cleaning up the shit show from the dumb asses.

      If you think that reserved contemplative individual cannot and will not do damage you’re missing the point.

      Lastly if that is truly how they feel, hoist the black flag and start slitting throats. Stop attacking those on their own side, stop whining and bitching, if truly there is no voting your way out of this tyranny, pull the card. Because if there is no method through the courts and legislature, all that is left is the cartridge box. Because if you can’t do it through political means all that is left is force.

  15. Bob Ratliff says:

    I would like to know, how many people were arrested for breaking The Law?!! All of this Bad Mouthing you are doing and all, I hope its because these people are more than just bad actors in a Constittutional Act!

    • Barron says:

      If you think I’m against open carry I suggest you take the 5 seconds and use the search box on my blog. Here I’ll even link it for you.

      So do you really think my beef is with doing something I do as protected by the constitution, or be the behavior of people who go beyond what is protected to the realm of threatening and intimidation.

      As I said in the article:

      I suspect this is going to backfire as anyone who can legally own a firearm but does not have a CPL must open carry. I don’t concealed carry or open carry, I just freaking carry. The problem is we have people like the above who carry at people and that is the problem.

      Note I said carry AT people, this is the problem, not carry. There’s a reason they were threatened with a 270 violation. Honestly I wish the WSP had nailed them on it.

      If me laying out exactly what I saw, the sequence of events leading up to it, and what happened is “bad mouthing,” maybe the people doing those things should clean up their act and you shouldn’t be ridiculing me for pointing it out.

  16. PeaceableGuy says:

    From what I’ve seen of Gavin Seim, he’s not a gun-brandishing buffoon with itchy fingers. The guy helped put together a scene where 2000-ish people got together enmasse and said “bugger your illegal law” while blatantly violating it in public preannounced. This is a step up from the comparatively simple act of ignoring illegal, unConstitutional law such as was already being done in Connecticut and New York.

    The contemplative man in the back still hasn’t done anything aside from perhaps make the occasional insightful statement to the apparently deaf ears of the legislature. While it is undeniable that such individuals CAN be mortally dangerous to tyrants, the only two chaps who seem to have gotten up from their seats in the back were Marvin Heemeyer and Joe Stack. We’ve easily had a decade to contemplate the observation that the usurpation throttle is jammed wide open, and I wonder just what sort of things are being contemplated in the rear that have a greater impact than an armored Komatsu D355A and a single-engined love letter to the federal revenuers?

    I’ll happily eat crow if, all evidence to the contrary aside, lawbreakers in office suddenly remember that all just government power is inherent to the people and then repent of their wickedness while filling in the morass of illegal non-laws in an orderly and expedited manner. Further, I urge those who still see hope along that path to go down it and either succeed or run into a brick wall of hopeless futility.

    For those whom have logically recognized the morality in giving illegal non-laws exactly the respect and obedience they deserve, which is none at all, I can only assume it would be appreciated if daggers belonging to ideological kinsfolk do not join those of government in their backs.

    From such allies’ point of view, it’s harder to make formally repealing already void unConstitutional laws more difficult than “impossible”. For every inch gained in that arena, a mile has been lost. It’s almost enough to bring to mind an old saying about doing the same thing over and over again while expecting a different result…

    • I too am impressed with Gavin Seim. And to associate him with the latter group is slanderous because he patently refused to come to yesterday’s rally because they were ‘initially’ also supporters of amoral sexual practices. I heeded Gavin’s example and did not go to the rally, though I supported it (but not the pervert sideshow).

      That at the last minute oathkeepers and others came shows that the event was far bigger than any attempt by sideshows to redirect focus to ancilliary issues. Either lead, follow, or get the hell out of the way.

  17. PeaceableGuy says:

    My below post was intended to be in the place of this one, as a reply to Barron.

    I’ll also note that there is one step left before choosing to “hoist the black flag and start slitting throats”: the peaceful disregarding of unConstitutional laws, laws that even the fedgov has recognized as possessing the same legal effect as never having been passed in the first place.

    When those people are wantonly imprisoned or killed (as admittedly is already a regular occurance), then the only choice left is whether to live as a slave or to fight back in righteous self-defense.

    • Barron says:

      So where was the guy carrying the suppressed full auto SBR without a stamp? Oh that’s right, there wasn’t one. SBS without a stamp… nope. Did see a nice pick of a guy with a muzzle loader while the kid was reaching for the trigger, great PR there by the way. Way to help when there’s a bill regarding safe storage coming up.

      If you want to do that, do that. Fight back against the law effectively and do so with a plan. Ending up in prison doesn’t help. Ending with a criminal record doesn’t help. Many made the same claims about Lenord Embody, all he did was fuck it up for everyone else.

      Further this post was on the rally on the 15th, the behavior of them on the 15th. I don’t give two shits what they did yesterday. They burned their bridge in being able to communicate and ask for my support and I laid out exactly why above.

      They did so in their actions and behavior at the rally on the 15th.

      • Ok, your foul language outs you as being hysterically vile, thus giving no credence to your views. I heartily suggest you strive to have more civil speech, young fellow. I’m out of here.

        • Barron says:

          Darrell, You have come into my house, shit on my floor, and act like you’re holier than thou. You’re now upset cause I used the word fuck.

          Entertainingly I’m not on the side of the people who did all that crap yesterday, much less the 15th. But you bitch about “amoral sexual practices”. I guess it’s just freedom and liberty for some and not for others who’s choices are outside your comfort zone?

          Firearms are a basic civil right. Period dot. Everyone has a right to them from the gay couple down the corner, to the interracial couple across the street, to every damn person on this planet. If they want to come out and support me in that fight I will welcome and whole heartily embrace them.

          As for keeping my speech civil, sir you have not seen me uncivil. I find the use of the word FUCK a fantastic litmus test to find those who do not understand the most basic of things:

          “He who takes offense when no offense is intended is a fool, and he who takes offense when offense is intended is a greater fool.” – Brigham Young

          Additionally is a great word to be used to provide punch and emphasis on a subject.

          I have a limited number of fucks to give in my life time, and you sir have now illustrated not just once but twice you’re not worth my time.

          Have a good day.

  18. PeaceableGuy says:

    Barron, it’s not so much asking for your help as it is to make a point about the statement “get off my side”. Again, the busy-fingered attention-seekers are welcomed by no one, yet those are a far cry from mere disagreements in form among principled individuals with differing lines in the sand.

    I was limiting the scope of my posts to the Dec 13th event, while acknowledging the mutually-recognized idiocy of a few individuals on Jan 15th.

    In regards to your recent post at 0857, I’m confused as it appears you are criticizing others for not breaking enough illegal laws. The answer I have for THAT sort of criticism is: the only people who have standing to say that are people who have already broken similar illegal laws. I will note that others have indeed already done exactly what you seem to want done, and one such fellow is named Wayne Fincher. He didn’t get a lot of support for righteously ignoring illegal law, and even though some might consider his efforts wasted, people with plans to continue on along his path of ignoring illegal laws have well noted the futility of using the courts to seek justice.

    Wayne Fincher, David Olofson, Gavin Seim, nor even Lenord Embody (based upon what little I know of him) – none of these people were criminals in their actions taken to violate illegal law. The criminals involved in such cases were government agents enforcing laws that their own courts recognized as having no legal effect at all!

    You are of course free to choose to whom you lend your support. I merely suggest the idea that dismissing people who have chosen a different path while pursuing the same goal may well be short-sighted.